4AGE vs B16A

[VTECBrag]

Small displacement with huge power engines like these are complete legends on their own right... We'll probably never have engines like these again. These are the hearts of the Pocket rockets that rocked the car world in the 90s and put the exotic car manufacturers to shame, so they had to up the ante to keep up.
Stats:
Toyota 4age: black top
BorexStroke: 81.0x77.0 (1587cc)
Compression: 11.0
TWINCAM, 20 valve (5 valves per cylinder) with VVT
Power: 165 PS (121 kW; 163 hp) at 7800 rpm with 162 N·m (119 ft·lbf) at 5200 rpm of torque.
individual throttle bodies,
individual runner headers: 4-2-1 design,
Aluminium head with cast iron block
rev limit 8200 rpm

Honda B16A: JDM version (2nd generation)
BorexStroke: 81.0x77.4 (1595cc)
Displacement: 1,595 cc (97.3 cu in)
Compression: 10.4:1
Power: 130 kW (177 PS; 174 bhp) @ 7800 rpm & 111 ft·lbf (150 N·m) @ 7300 rpm
Redline:8200

[Nfs9903]

correction:
1) the Blacktop 4AGE compression is 11:1, whereas the Silvertop's compression ratio is 10.5:1.
2) 4AGE blacktop header design is 4-2-1
3) 4AGE blacktop rev limit is 8200rpm

[B16A]

one difference is the B16A has lift control while the 4age doesn't. also, if its a question of which one is faster, that depends on the curb weight of the car the engine is in.

[VTECBrag]

@NFS9903, corrections made, thanks for the info
@B16A, lets stick to engine dynamics and torque curves,
I totally agree with you; An AE86 or AE92 with Blacktop will beat a CIVIC SiR with a stock JDM B16A anyday but they'l be left behind by a CRX with a JDM B16A. True, it depends on the weight of the engine and the suspension set up (soft springs reduce acceleration)
Lets talk about how technically each engine is diverse, each engine produces the high horse power number and lets look at the torque curves.
Lets also talk about the Mod potentials behind each engine. Im expecting Tysir and Salman (you) go head on with this... lol
I'l post up the dyno charts later.

[VTECBrag]

the torque shows the strength of the 4age in the midrange but the torque and horse power starts tapering off... this is a clear disadvantage in a straightline where power at the high end comes in more handy.
But this is also an advantage as it allows the use of long ratio gears and also the corner exit acceleration in a track is also better.
The B16A has a wonderfully flat torque which stays consistent through to the rpm limit. This is clearly a superior engine in terms of engineering, but on the track the lower midrange torque means corner exits have lower drama.
A trueno vs a Civic SiR will show the trueno gaining in tight turns and low speed winding tracks but the Civic SiR will soon gain on the trueno on the straights.
Ironically the torque curve of the B16A shows it will be better with a 6 speed close ratio gear box which can keep the rpm range between 6500 to 8000, but there was NO 6spd manual released.
On the otherhand the 4AGE would benefit from taller ratio ranging from 5000-7500 runs that would keep it right at its peak torque range but the black top did come with a 6 spd manual. Would've done better with a 5 speed.

[nacief_aviator]

@ VTECBrag and B16A......

I always love your posts.....I get to learn so many things......

you people are among the very few who genuinely know their stuff.....thanks for all your insight.....

[B16A]

another thing i would like to point out is that the B16A was first introduced in 1988 and the first in the world to have variable valve timing. the ST 4AGE came out in 1991 and the BT came out in 1995

also, the AE92 or AE86 came with 16V 4age. so u r comparing a modified car with a stock EK4...it is not apple to apple comparison. y not compare a AE111 with an EK9? lets not forget about the B16B!

[Drohi]

I thought this topic was about the B16A so where does the ek9 type r come in from ? if you wanna compare a Ek9 Type r then compare it to a car with a 3S-GE

[B16A]

I totally agree with you; An AE86 or AE92 with Blacktop will beat a CIVIC SiR with a stock JDM B16A anyday

my point was, as i clearly mentioned, the ae92 or ae86 came with 16V 4age, not a BT 20V 4age. so comparing a modified car with a stock car is not apple to apple comparison. and any stock car with 4age or b16a is faster than a stock car with 3sge...so no comparison there anyway. lastly, i think that a better comparison would be the BT 20V 4A-GE vs. B16B CTR! as both of these engines are the last of their generation.

[VTECBrag]

Not comparing stock vehicles but stock engines. Was merely describing the effect of chassis weight on acceleration, a point you had mentioned. Yeah, the ae111 vs sir2 would be the best comparison. But lets stick to the engines